Student Post - On Romania's Consideration of Whether to Decriminalize Consensual Incest

All 50 United States and the District of Columbia have made incest, even when consensual, illegal.  Yet, in Europe, incest is not always a crime. 

As a recent article by the Associated Press noted France, Spain, and Portugal do not prosecute for crimes of incest for consenting adults, and that Romania is considering decriminalizing consensual incest. Romania is currently reforming its entire criminal code, and in doing so is considering decriminalizing incest between consenting adults.  As it now exists, Romania considers ALL FORMS of incest punishable for up to 7 years in prison.  The change is being contemplated by Romania’s Justice Ministry to become more legally similar to some other European Union members. 

Justice Ministry legal expert Valerian Cioclei, as quoted in the Associated Press, states: “Not everything that is immoral has to be illegal. We cannot help these people by turning them into criminals and punishing them.”

What am I missing? It’s not the law, in this case, that would be turning these people into criminals, it is their actions. A murderer, for example, doesn’t need a conviction to be a murderer.  And yes, while we might not necessarily be helping these criminals by punishing them, we certainly are helping society, at large, in validating that certain actions, whether moral or immoral, are illegal, period.

Thankfully, it seems like Romania will resist.  The Associated Press notes that strong opposition exists among some lawmakers in the ruling coalition and that newspaper articles in Romania have criticized the proposed change.  The Ministry’s response is that “incest cannot be stopped with criminal sanctions, but with medical and social measures, because incest is based on pathological factors.”  While I agree that incest may be based on pathological factors, that does not mean it cannot be stopped with criminal sanctions nor does it mean that it should not be punished.  Many would argue the same exact thing for many other disorders that cause people to act in illegal ways.  Where do we draw the line?

Comments

[eAdvocate]

Student comments: "What am I missing? It’s not the law, in this case, that would be turning these people into criminals, it is their actions. A murderer, for example, doesn’t need a conviction to be a murderer. And yes, while we might not necessarily be helping these criminals by punishing them, we certainly are helping society, at large, in validating that certain actions, whether moral or immoral, are illegal, period. "

Student Post asks "What am I missing?" You are missing Culture, Values and Beliefs all around the world they are different and your post doesn't recognize this.

Would it be a perfect world if everyone was alike? Would the U.S. be better or perfect if every state had the same laws? Why do people have differences of opinion based on the same set of facts? Would we need lawyers and courts if everyone had the same opinion?

Something to think about: Why do some prosecutors charge kids for "Sexting" and other prosecutors fail to do so? Likewise are Romeo and Juliet cases, I'd bet some prosecutors simply do not prosecute ALL such cases that come before them.

Cultures, Values and Beliefs...

[George]

Leaving the incest issue aside for the moment, by murder do you mean assisted suicide? That is the only consensual murder I'm aware of and that is assuming it is actually murder. Not too many people consent to being murdered. Maybe sharing illegal drugs would be a better analogy.

[Jimbino]

Ridiculous. Not honoring your mother and father was a crime punishable by death.

There is no reason, other than Biblical nonsense that would make incest immoral, particularly when practiced by sterile people. Even Einstein married his first cousin, as have generations of great musicians.

The Bonobos do it all the time and it apparently keeps them from warring among themselves as the Chimpanzees do.

And what would make incest between two gay brothers or gay sisters immoral (apart from Biblical nonsense)?

[Mika Cooper]

Exactly what is the problem with consensual incest? I mean other than that people SAY it's wrong? What's really wrong with it and why should a society torment those who practice it? Because we're sadists and like to torment those who are different?

[lawdoc]

"What am I missing? It’s not the law, in this case, that would be turning these people into criminals, it is their actions."

"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread." Anatoly France

[Daniel]

I am glad to see that the first responder and everyone else picked up on the basic flaw in the OP.

There is no action that is illegal until a society makes it illegal. And that includes murder. Actions have no legal meaning outside of the social and culture norms in which those action take place.

In every case it is exactly and specifically the law that turns people into criminals. Because if nothing were illegal, there would be no criminals.